Comments on: Harsh Realities http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/ A blog/community created for teenage girls who care about their rights as women and want to be heard. Sun, 20 May 2012 22:35:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Steph http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2325 Steph Wed, 25 Nov 2009 05:28:39 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2325 @Jenna: Misusing pronouns *is* mistreatment of trans-identified individuals. Using the wrong pronouns, even when corrected, misgenders these students, and leads to further discrimination. Leslie Feinberg, in hir speech at LaTeisha Green's memorial, said that "[p]ronouns are important: they are an expression of body and self, of personhood." Using the wrong ones, then, is a deliberate dismissal of a person's identity. Also, 'gays and lesbians' =/= trans-identified people. Trans is not, convenient as it might be, gay, turned up to eleven. There are trans-identified lesbians, trans-identified gay men, and trans-identified people who are straight, or asexual, or bi/pan, or what have you. While it irks me to have to use the 'you're not trans and you don't get it' point, you're not, and you don't - not to say that you can't, but you don't at the present moment. When people use the wrong pronouns for you, it outs you in an uncontrolled fashion. Not only is it <i>wrong</i>, it's <i>dangerous</i>. You don't know how other people will or might react. Personally, I've spent sixteen years being called 'he' and 'him', and I'm fucking sick of it, and being misgendered actually causes me severe emotional distress, and it hurts, it fucking hurts. So no, "bitching about which pronoun to use" isn't insignificant or nitpicky. In fact, it pretty much <b>defines</b> "doing something". @Jenna: Misusing pronouns *is* mistreatment of trans-identified individuals. Using the wrong pronouns, even when corrected, misgenders these students, and leads to further discrimination.
Leslie Feinberg, in hir speech at LaTeisha Green’s memorial, said that “[p]ronouns are important: they are an expression of body and self, of personhood.” Using the wrong ones, then, is a deliberate dismissal of a person’s identity.

Also, ‘gays and lesbians’ =/= trans-identified people. Trans is not, convenient as it might be, gay, turned up to eleven. There are trans-identified lesbians, trans-identified gay men, and trans-identified people who are straight, or asexual, or bi/pan, or what have you.

While it irks me to have to use the ‘you’re not trans and you don’t get it’ point, you’re not, and you don’t – not to say that you can’t, but you don’t at the present moment.

When people use the wrong pronouns for you, it outs you in an uncontrolled fashion. Not only is it wrong, it’s dangerous. You don’t know how other people will or might react.

Personally, I’ve spent sixteen years being called ‘he’ and ‘him’, and I’m fucking sick of it, and being misgendered actually causes me severe emotional distress, and it hurts, it fucking hurts.

So no, “bitching about which pronoun to use” isn’t insignificant or nitpicky. In fact, it pretty much defines “doing something”.

]]> By: Danielle http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2316 Danielle Tue, 24 Nov 2009 23:48:01 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2316 Sorry about those pronouns! Guess I really should have re-read what I wrote before I sent it in. :/ I think I wrote "he" because when I was in primary school I still used "he" and so it just kind of kept going when I went back in my memories. Sorry about those pronouns! Guess I really should have re-read what I wrote before I sent it in. :/ I think I wrote “he” because when I was in primary school I still used “he” and so it just kind of kept going when I went back in my memories.

]]> By: Jenna http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2315 Jenna Tue, 24 Nov 2009 23:12:03 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2315 Yes. Let's worry about pronoun use rather than the actual issues at hand. I swear, between this and the Twilight article I just read... Mistreatment of gays and lesbians is a horrible evil. But instead of doing something about it, we're bitching about which pronoun to use. Gimme a break. Yes. Let’s worry about pronoun use rather than the actual issues at hand. I swear, between this and the Twilight article I just read…

Mistreatment of gays and lesbians is a horrible evil. But instead of doing something about it, we’re bitching about which pronoun to use. Gimme a break.

]]> By: Kati http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2312 Kati Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:14:03 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2312 Great piece, but is there any way you can correct the pronouns? If she refered to herself as a she so should you. But no big deal, everyone slips up. Great piece, but is there any way you can correct the pronouns? If she refered to herself as a she so should you. But no big deal, everyone slips up.

]]> By: Steph http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2311 Steph Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:42:04 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2311 oops - that should read "pronouns are <i>often</i> a huge issue". oops – that should read “pronouns are often a huge issue”.

]]> By: Steph http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2306 Steph Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:33:56 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2306 Thank you, Danielle, thank you SO MUCH for posting this. The entire study is well worth a read, and probably eye-opening to those who don't think about trans issues very often. In which case, I'll also recommend <a href="t-vox.org/index.php?title=Trans_101" rel="nofollow">a couple</a> <a href="http://nixwilliams.blogspot.com/2008/10/getting-pronouns-right-guide-for-spoken.html" rel="nofollow">of useful</a> <a href="http://birdofparadox.wordpress.com/2009/02/28/yet-another-trans-101-in-which-helen-tells-cis-people-whats-what/" rel="nofollow">articles to</a> <a href="http://takesupspace.wordpress.com/cis-privilege-checklist/" rel="nofollow">refer </a>.href="http://queersunited.blogspot.com/2008/10/how-to-be-trans-ally.html">to.</a> But still, when over one in four trans students reports being the victim of <b>physical violence</b> in the last year, you've got an issue. When your GPA drops because going to school means you'll get beaten up again, and you worry that you won't get into the program you want (and would have been qualified for if you weren't skipping school so often), you have to balance academic goals with self-preservation. When 18 percent of trans-identified students feel that their school administration protects them from hate speech and violence some to most of the time, and only ten percent feel that they do a good job of it, there's obviously a set of issues to deal with. If there's anyone out there reading this comment who just doesn't get it, and has looked at the links I provided above, I'd be happy to explain my experience with regards to whatever's on their mind. (also, as a side note, Danielle, if the person you knew referred to herself as a girl, then she WAS a girl, and the proper pronouns for her are not he/him/his, but she/her/hers. Just an aside, as pronouns are a huge issue for trans-identified folk like myself.) Thank you, Danielle, thank you SO MUCH for posting this. The entire study is well worth a read, and probably eye-opening to those who don’t think about trans issues very often. In which case, I’ll also recommend a couple of useful articles to refer .href=”http://queersunited.blogspot.com/2008/10/how-to-be-trans-ally.html”>to.

But still, when over one in four trans students reports being the victim of physical violence in the last year, you’ve got an issue. When your GPA drops because going to school means you’ll get beaten up again, and you worry that you won’t get into the program you want (and would have been qualified for if you weren’t skipping school so often), you have to balance academic goals with self-preservation.
When 18 percent of trans-identified students feel that their school administration protects them from hate speech and violence some to most of the time, and only ten percent feel that they do a good job of it, there’s obviously a set of issues to deal with.

If there’s anyone out there reading this comment who just doesn’t get it, and has looked at the links I provided above, I’d be happy to explain my experience with regards to whatever’s on their mind.

(also, as a side note, Danielle, if the person you knew referred to herself as a girl, then she WAS a girl, and the proper pronouns for her are not he/him/his, but she/her/hers. Just an aside, as pronouns are a huge issue for trans-identified folk like myself.)

]]> By: Austin http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2305 Austin Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:17:28 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2305 I do realise that you're trying to do an ally piece, but it would really help if you didn't refer to the girl you knew when in NZ as a boy. From the information here presented (of course you know about the situation more than I, you having been there) you have described how she knew herself to be female - why are you then going and misgendering her? I do realise that you’re trying to do an ally piece, but it would really help if you didn’t refer to the girl you knew when in NZ as a boy. From the information here presented (of course you know about the situation more than I, you having been there) you have described how she knew herself to be female – why are you then going and misgendering her?

]]> By: Toongrrl http://thefbomb.org/2009/11/harsh-realities/comment-page-1/#comment-2304 Toongrrl Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:54:47 +0000 http://thefbomb.org/?p=1668#comment-2304 I hope he graduated out of the 6th grade to college. I hope he graduated out of the 6th grade to college.

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