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• Ryan @ at 12:34 pm, August 6th, 2010
  

  Yea men are 85% of the homeless. Sorry about the unshaven man with lifeless eyes. Women won’t have him because males don’t have value to the opposite sex for the simple fact that they exist like women do to men.

  Maybe we should kill them or put those lifeless burdens of men in a cage so those desolate spirits won’t grasp on to women.

• Tessa @ at 1:35 pm, August 6th, 2010
  

  What a terrible, elitist poem. That man on the street you just described was probably a homeless man. Please, check your privilege next time you write a poem like this. “Lifeless eyes” and “santa claus beard” just evokes sympathy for this man rather than for you and your privilege. As a feminist, I absolutely despise it when a poem is written by a privileged person against someone who is much less fortunate.

• K.O. @ at 2:02 pm, August 6th, 2010
  

  Uh… Ryan, check your facts. Since the 1980′s women have been the majority of homeless people. Homeless women are much less visible than homeless men because the women tend to go to shelters or live out of cars much more often than begging.

  To both of you, assuming that the poem is even talking about a homeless man is ridiculous. In doing that you are saying that the only men who go outside and have large beards are homeless men.

  Also, being homeless or otherwise afflicted does not give any person the right to grope or otherwise harass people walking down the street. And I’ve never met any people so devoted to eradicating homelessness and poverty as feminists are, not just for suffering women, but men and children too.

• Ryan @ at 7:28 pm, August 6th, 2010
  

  “Also, being homeless or otherwise afflicted does not give any person the right to grope”

  Well it also does not give you the right to not have understanding or compassion for the male condition, esspecially that of homeless men. Women have shelters and government welfare which is not given to men in equal proportions.

  You say that feminists care about the needs of both genders but you are wrong, they focus on women and girls only. Women have never shown the willingness to provide for or protect men. In fact to nurture or care for a man is seen as oppression.

  My grandmother told me that her friends have noticed that family food recipies, some of which had been passed down from mother and grandmother to daughter for generations have largely dissapeared and been lost on todays women.

  Today women are the only gender that have choices. You will not take care of nor support men and children while he stays home. You will not pay on dates and you make men support you after divorce while also taking the children away from meaningful contact with their father.

  So let me ask you, what has changed for men now that women have choices to do what they want? Why can’t men have choices?

• Jordan @ at 10:17 pm, August 6th, 2010
  

  Ryan, it could be argued that women are given greater access to shelters and government welfare than men due to the higher rates of sexual and physical abuse experienced by homeless women. That is not to say that homeless men don’t deserve the help they need but it may be more imperative to protect women from becoming victims.
  And personally, if I was groped by any man, whether homeless or well off, I would be totally offended and any ‘understanding or compassion’ that I might have felt towards that person would quickly disappear. Living in poverty does not give anyone the right to exploit my body for their pleasure.
  Everybody has choices. I have never known a woman who wouldn’t support her partner and child financially. In fact I know families where the only parent that is working is the woman. As a young woman myself, I always pay on dates. I’ve been out with male friends and they always argue that they should pay, but I just see this is a form of control. I also come from a divorced family. I do believe that it is unfair that women usually gain custody of the children rather than men but my father greatly neglected me and refused to pay child support. I moved out as soon as I was of age and his choice to not financially support me has greatly limited my choices in life including education and health. I also know of many fathers who have walked out on their children leaving great debt and heartache.
  In my opinion, men have always had choices because they have had the power and a lot of the time they have used that power to continue limiting women’s choices. There is no one stopping you from gaining an educaton, healthcare, legal representatives, safety or anything else you desire purely because of your sex and there never will be. That’s not so for women, especially in developing countries.
  There will always be small inequalities between sexes because of our different needs but because you have a penis, generally you’re better off.

• Emily @ at 2:22 am, August 7th, 2010
  

  Ryan, if you don’t agree with the feminist values of this site, why waste your time on it? In my opinion, you are simply commenting on these articles deliberately to evoke a reaction or cause an argument with the others browsing here. Maybe you should go complain about the so called “inequality” of men and whatever else you believe on some other site, it’s not wanted here.

• Ryan @ at 7:05 am, August 7th, 2010
  

  “I know families where the only parent that is working is the woman”

  I hope women get used to this because men are not projected to fare as well as women in The New Economy.

  Women confer 60% of college degrees, have women first college admission through Affirmative Action and had the stimulus package devoted to them though 80% of all jobs lost have been to men.(see: No Country For Burly Men by Christina Hoff Sommers)

  Female gender secular and seperatist representation by gender in government will have its toll on us all.

• Ryan @ at 7:15 am, August 7th, 2010
  

  you say: “my father greatly neglected me and refused to pay child support. I moved out as soon as I was of age and his choice to not financially support me has greatly limited my choices in life including education and health. I also know of many fathers who have walked out on their children leaving great debt and heartache.”

  Why would a man want to support a woman and child that are no longer a part of his family or his life. Men, after divorce have no right to play a meaningful role in the lives of our children. Men need that money to start their own family and not to support a womans.

  70% of all divorce is initiated by women. Of the 30 % initiated by men most do not involve children. Married men very rarely leave their families or children.

• Steph @ at 7:36 pm, August 7th, 2010
  

  Ryan, I’m mostly agreeing with you here, but the bit about “Why would a man want to support a woman and child that are no longer a part of his family or his life” is fucked up, and I hope you can realize that.

  If you’re saying that men should have no attachment to their ex-wives and children, and see them as money drains preventing them from starting “their own family”-and I think that’s what you’re saying, you’re almost as offensive to men as you are to women. If the only aspect of a family that a man cares about is his control over them, that’s not a healthy dynamic. You argue men should avoid child support so they can “start their own family” – what about the family they’re leaving behind, abandoning?
  Men, after divorce have no right to play a meaningful role in the lives of our children.
  are men maligned by custody laws? Yeah, unfortunately they are. Do they have “no right” to be in their children’s lives? No, outside of certain dangerous situations, like abuse.

  And I was about to agree with you, but then you came up with “Women have never shown the willingness to provide for or protect men. In fact to nurture or care for a man is seen as oppression”.

  (ps? I learned family recipes from my (divorced) father, and cooking is one of the ways we stay close. Bemoaning that women aren’t learning their grandmothers’ recipes restricts women’s work to domestic roles. )

• Ryan @ at 11:04 pm, August 7th, 2010
  

  For you to expect and force a man into the “provider” role in dating, marriage AND after divorce is abhorent and grossly demeaning and oppressive to men.

  Men do not have an obligation to support women, provide for them nor protect them.

  Let me ask you what social and lawful obligations do women have toward men? NONE. Women have choic

• Ryan @ at 11:05 pm, August 7th, 2010
  

  For you to expect and force a man into the “provider” role in dating, marriage AND after divorce is abhorent and grossly demeaning and oppressive to men.

  Men do not have an obligation to support women, provide for them nor protect them.

  Let me ask you, think real hard about this, what social and lawful obligations do women have toward men? NONE. Women have choices, men responsibility to support those choices.

• Ryan @ at 11:10 pm, August 7th, 2010
  

  Men deserve the right to our bodies and the fruits of its labor just as women have.

  Men don’t have the obligation do anything for women just as you have demanded choices not to have to do anything for men.

  Marriage is about women. Women have no liabilities in divorce. Type” “men going” into google amd you will see where it says we are going, mostly “our own way”.

• Ryan @ at 11:24 pm, August 7th, 2010
  

  Listen it really is very simple. Think about it, what responsibilities or obligation do women have toward and for men?

  You have none. Obviously, men should have no obligation to you. Make sense?

• Steph @ at 12:59 am, August 9th, 2010
  

   
  For you to expect and force a man into the “provider” role in dating, marriage AND after divorce is abhorent and grossly demeaning and oppressive to men.
  Ryan. We. Are. Teenagers. We do not do these things. We are, generally, neither married nor divorced. 

  Men do not have an obligation to support women, provide for them nor protect them.
  “to love and cherish, in sickness and in health…I promise to cherish and respect you, to care and protect you, to comfort and encourage you…for all eternity.”
  And then there’s that thing some people call love. Pesky little thing, isn’t it? Sure is fortunate you don’t feel it toward your family. An obligation to “support…provide for…[and] protect” your loved one is essentially what love is. 

  Let me ask you what social and lawful obligations do women have toward men? NONE. Women have choices, men responsibility to support those choices.

  28 percent of married women are the primary wage-earners in their (partnered) households [source]
   And that’s primary. With the data that 49.7% of households consist of married couples[2006 us census] and that another 10.1% are unmarried couples[census again], that puts male-female coupled households at 59.8% of all households. 
  If 28% of all households have female primary wage-earners, that leaves 31.8 percent of married households with male primary wage-earners. Still more, but does that resemble men entirely supporting women? Didn’t think so.

   Men deserve the right to our bodies and the fruits of its labor just as women have.
  You can have your spunk. When you bear a child for nine months, then it’ll be “the fruit of its labor”. Because sex is such a damned chore right?

  Men don’t have the obligation do anything for women just as you have demanded choices not to have to do anything for men.
  I don’t understand what you mean by this. Honestly, I don’t. 

  Marriage is about women.
  Silly me, thinking that love had anything to do with it. Also, I can’t help but think gay men are going to be pissed when they find that one out. 
  Women have no liabilities in divorce. Type” “men going” into google amd you will see where it says we are going, mostly “our own way”.
  I was wondering when we’d get to this. You know MGTOW is a hate group, right? They advocate complete separation from women in order that “men can be men”, far from the corrupting influence of women. They’re (proudly) anti-feminist, anti-woman, homophobic, transphobic, and they (you?) call male feminists “backstabbers [of] men’s rights”[source]. Jeez, you might as well be getting your arguments from Stormfront. Maybe that’s a bit over the top, but fuck it, I’ve said it. There. 
   
  Listen it really is very simple. Think about it, what responsibilities or obligation do women have toward and for men?
  To men who are their partners? The same ones men have to women who are their partners. 

  You have none. Obviously, men should have no obligation to you. Make sense?
  Even were your assumption true, no, it doesn’t make sense. Equality isn’t about lowering everyone down until we’re all at the level of the lowest among us, it’s about raising everyone up to the best that we all can be. 

• Steph @ at 1:02 am, August 9th, 2010
  

  Also, Sarah, I’m terribly sorry to be disrupting the comment thread to your post like this. I just didn’t think it was fair to let his comments go unquestioned.

• Ryan @ at 2:03 am, August 9th, 2010
  

   Men deserve the right to our bodies and the fruits of its labor just as women have.

  You can have your spunk. When you bear a child for nine months, then it’ll be “the fruit of its labor”. Because sex is such a damned chore right?

  I’m not talking about sex I’m talking male labor and the monetary fruits bared forth by it. Contrary to female belief, men don’t have an obligation to support a woman and “her” child.

  Men’s bodies are not your property.

• Ryan @ at 2:08 am, August 9th, 2010
  

  Those marriage vows are from a different time. I find It very telling that you will not let me post the graphs on marriage rates, divorce rates and single mother births. What are you trying to hide?

  Vows are not law. Look at the law and how it is practiced. Those vows mean nothing. Men are the only ones made to provide to women in all aspects of our lives.

• Ryan @ at 2:16 am, August 9th, 2010
  

  Go ahead and believe that men and boys don’t have any legitimate issues and dismiss the voice of men’s feelings, thoughts and concerns as women hatred as usual.

  Typical self centered feminist.

• Steph @ at 10:52 am, August 9th, 2010
  

  I’m not talking about sex I’m talking male labor and the monetary fruits bared forth by it. Contrary to female belief, men don’t have an obligation to support a woman and “her” child.
  Maybe, but i’d expect a man yo help care for his.

   Those marriage vows are from a different time.
  Even so, they capture the popcultural definition of ‘marriage’.

  I find It very telling that you will not let me post the graphs on marriage rates, divorce rates and single mother births. What are you trying to hide?
  I’m not Julie, but it could have been the commentary you attached to those graphs which violated the comment policy. 

  Vows are not law.
  No, they’re not. But they’re something. They’re a promise you made your lady, and one which, apparently, you forgot. 
   Look at the law and how it is practiced. Those vows mean nothing.
  I never said they did. You’re getting mighty defensive all of a sudden.  Men are the only ones made to provide to women in all aspects of our lives.
  I’ve debunked this one so many times for you it’s not even funny.

   Go ahead and believe that men and boys don’t have any legitimate issues and dismiss the voice of men’s feelings, thoughts and concerns as women hatred as usual.
  That’s definitely not accurate. Ryan, I’m trans. I lived fifteen years as a boy. I have inside experience. I would never belittle men for who they are. What they say, sometimes, particularly when it’s this offensive and wrong. 

  I ask again:
  Is there room for love in your worldview? What does it look like?
  Is your presence in the MRM informed by your marital history?
  When are you going to go off-script? You’ve been giving the same four or five answers since you’ve been here.
  Please, answer me. Especially the one about love.   

• Sarah @ at 12:14 pm, August 9th, 2010
  

  I apologize to anyone who was offended by my poem. The man was in fact, NOT homeless, and I was speaking from experience. The fact that you pegged me as “privileged” Tessa, says a lot more about you than me, because I am not a privileged person. I’ve lived on the streets and dealt with things that many people would be revolted by. So thanks. I’m glad that you all (Ryan, Tessa) are so quick to judge others.

• Ryan @ at 2:27 pm, August 9th, 2010
  

  I am not judging you. You have no idea of what it is like to be a man. You should know that unlike you men are not valued by women for the simple fact that we exist.

  Men are told the most HORRIBLE things by women when we get rejected. You have no understanding of just what privilege you have as a woman and as a man I resent that.

  You need to have more understanding of the male experience and condition.

  You have no respect for men in the way you dress for the way it makes men feel. You call any request for modesty “victim blaming”. Feminists attempt to define masculinity and male sexuality. You attempt to define what men find sexually invoking or solicitous when you have no right to.

  Things that men do that make women feel the same is called harassment.

• Ryan @ at 2:39 pm, August 9th, 2010
  

  You speak about how men hold positions of, compete and obtain status in society without ever questioning the fact that it is motivated by forces for which you control.

  Males vie for dominance and positions of power over territory and resources because it gets us mating opportunity. All the lines between countries are drawn in the blood of men since the beginning of time for a reason. You have no respect for just how much men compete for and provide to you.

  Look at your own behavior.

• Ryan @ at 2:50 pm, August 9th, 2010
  

  Until women stop demanding the very things from men that you now compete against us for and do so unfairly by Affirmative Action, women first and women only laws you will not be our equal.

  Men should have NO obligation to provide to you while dating, marriage but most importantly AFTER DIVORCE if you want to be our equal. You should know that NOTHING has changed for men and we are stuck in the same role of provider. The only difference is that now you have more choices and less obligations as to the terms in which men are required to provide to you.

  You won’t give men the option of not supporting you. You will not give us the same choices you have afforded yourselves. You will not support men the same.

• Ryan @ at 7:45 pm, August 9th, 2010
  

  It looks like most of our conversation has been deleted here and on other threads Steph.

  How do you all as a community tolerate such staunch censorship?
  You all should really say something to the moderator.

• Ryan @ at 7:47 pm, August 9th, 2010
  

  Here are the graphs you asked for without any opinion tied to them so they should get passed the censorship. Make of them what you will.

  http://tinyurl.com/2flkuq8

  http://tinyurl.com/27gkfl9

  http://tinyurl.com/34qhb7m

• Julie Z @ at 11:50 am, August 10th, 2010
  

  @Ryan

  I’m sorry that you feel I’m censoring you – in fact you’re the only person whose comments I’ve felt that I needed to delete in MONTHS and as is apparent above, I think you’ve had MORE than your fair share of comments posted on this site.

  Here’s the deal. Comments of yours that I have deleted have mostly consisted of you speaking as if you know what it’s like to be a woman and in a lot of ways you’re portraying us as villains which I see as hateful – clearly contradicting my comments policy.

  Another thing: this is a site for TEENAGE feminists. Not all of us are teenagers, it’s true, and I encourage that intergenerational element, but at the same time you need to keep in mind you’re talking to young women who are finding their voices. Contradicting basically every post on this website is completely against we’re trying to accomplish, and in that capacity I feel I have the right to delete some of your comments.

  Seriously, if you don’t like what we’re doing here, don’t read this website.

• Ryan @ at 1:14 pm, August 10th, 2010
  

  “in a lot of ways you’re portraying us as villains which I see as hateful – clearly contradicting my comments policy.”

  Now I know why Lawrence Summers lost his job for speaking about and presenting objective data women found to be “insensitive” or hateful.

  I believe you and I may live by a different value system. I believe in freedom of speech and hope that you can to. People have a right to speak and others have the right to feel and no one has the right to control or silence either.

  Such foundations of Liberty were pioneered by the French and adopted by American’s. It became part of our heritage.

  It is based on the premise of maintaining our collective individual Liberty by giving all people the right to speak and feel. Such ethics extend to Independence and Freedom.

  “I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” – Voltaire

• Ryan @ at 1:22 pm, August 10th, 2010
  

  Sarah says: “I apologize to anyone who was offended by my poem.”

  I was offended but feel it mostly to be a lack of understanding between us. I may have felt it could be perceived as hateful as well.

  I welcome your apology but it is unecessary. You have the right to speak and I have the right to feel and have an opinion about it.

  “I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” – Voltaire

• Emily @ at 9:11 am, August 11th, 2010
  

  Ryan. You disagree to basically every post on this website. You are only trying to create arguments, it’s easy to see. If you love trolling so much, find some other site where no-one minds. What are you even trying to accomplish here? From the tone of your posts, it sounds as if you are trying to portray that all women are somehow evil, penis-hating oppressers who will do anything in their power to hurt men. I’m sorry, but no-one else here shares the opinion you seem so desperate to prove. Have some respect

• Ryan @ at 10:20 am, August 12th, 2010
  

  Hello Emily,

  I see, and do you have anything to add to the conversation regarding the topics at hand?

• Halle @ at 8:10 pm, October 21st, 2010
  

  Lovely poem!!! Beautiful!

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