Feminism | Posted by Julie Z on 08/7/2010

Saturday Vids: Nona Willis Aronowitz & Feminist Experimentation

You may remember Nona from the post I wrote about GirlDrive (her really super awesome book) and her guest post about Hooking Up. Well, Nona recently did some social experimentin’ involving feminism, to some interesting results.

Give Nona some love on twitter: twitter.com/girldrive and her blog.

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  • Zoe @ at 11:58 am, August 7th, 2010

    Interesting. There was a little bit of both positive and negative associations in there.

  • Megan @ at 3:51 pm, August 7th, 2010

    I agree, it was very interesting. I would also like to offer some advice to Ryan who has been commenting regularly. You might want to visit the website of sociologist Michael Kimmel. He teaches at the State University of New York at Stony Brook. He is an expert on gender and masculinity. He is also a spokesman of NOMAS(The National Organisation For Men Against Sexism).His views on feminism are positive. It might help to dispell some of those misconceptions you have about females. We are not the enemy! The obvious hatred you have toward women is disturbing. In the 21st century there should be more understanding and mutual respect between the sexes. Yes, there are certain biological differences between men and women, but we are also more alike then people are taught to believe we are as Michael Kimmel points out in his book The Gendered Society. I offer this advice with genuine kindness, because no one as obviously bitter as you are can be happy.

  • Ryan @ at 10:53 pm, August 7th, 2010

    What self respecting man would become a part of a group that advocates the alienation of children from their fathers and thinks men are supposed to be a provider to women?

    What type of man ignores the startling amount of sexism, injustice and bias against men and boys? Male Studies not the feminist Men’s Studies is on the horizon. Gay men,men with gender identity disorder and women have no right to define masculinity of hetersexual men.

  • O'Phylia @ at 1:03 am, August 8th, 2010

    The man that recognizes that it’s not feminism that created that sexism, but the patriarchy.

  • Megan @ at 1:49 am, August 8th, 2010

    Your bitter,nasty attitude is worse than I thought. It’s eating you out like a disease.I wont waste my time trying to reason with you.Obviously your hatred and bigotry extends to gay men as well as women.This sense of white,hetersexual male entitlement is ugly and too often leads to violence against women and gay people. How can you believe it’s your entitlement to act like that? People like you are a danger to society. Like it or not you have the problem. Do yourself a favour and seek therapy.

  • Ryan @ at 4:45 am, August 8th, 2010

    First of all calm down. Second, when you take away what you’ve been trained to see, you will realize that I never said I hate anybody.

    What I said was “gay men, men with gender identity disorder (which is a medically defined pathology) and women have no right to define masculinity in the context of the normative experience of heterosexual males.

    What gives them the right to speak for others and define them when in many if not most respects we have nothing in common and thus this is why they identify as feminists.

  • Ryan @ at 4:56 am, August 8th, 2010

    “The man that recognizes that it’s not feminism that created that sexism, but the patriarchy.”

    WOW so males created all these problems? You have been taught well.

    When you begin to realize that men are not the source or cause of the worlds problems the gender war may cease. Untill then I will defend myself, and all men and boys from matriarchy. In matriarchy, men are not a member of the family or the lives of our children. In fact they are unaware of who may even be the father.

    Males have little place in a matrarchal society.

  • Ryan @ at 5:12 am, August 8th, 2010

    40% of all births in the U.S. are now to single women. If you want to destroy patriarchal civilization and thus remove males from paternal investment in their offspring this is fine but please, for God sake don’t expect males to have incentive to produce anything or support a woman and her child in any way.

    It is time women become independent, self supporting and take care of their own children. Again, men are not a part of the matriarchal family and have no obligation to support one.

  • O'Phylia @ at 11:41 am, August 8th, 2010

    And you think patriarchy = males?

    Aw honey, bless your heart.

    Patriarchy is a system, not a group of people.

    And that is all for the semantics lesson for today! You’re welcome.

  • Ryan @ at 4:06 pm, August 8th, 2010

    Patriarchy is a system of what?

    Please I implore you, patriarchy is a system of what?

  • Ryan @ at 4:18 pm, August 8th, 2010

    Patriarchy will end when women are no longer hypergamous.

    Patriarchy will end when you no longer expect men to support or pay for you in dating, marriage or after divorce.

    It will end when you allow men the same choices you have given yourselves and free us from having to support you and bear liabilities toward you in all aspects of our lives.

  • Ryan @ at 4:20 pm, August 8th, 2010

    Feminism has changed nothing for men.

  • Ryan @ at 6:31 pm, August 8th, 2010

    Instead men are beginning to form Male Studies which will serve to contrast the viewpoint of the women’s Men’s Studies and associated groups such as NOMAS

    Male Studies is an attempt for men to be able to express and understand the male experience FROM A MALE PERSPECTIVE.

    http://www.vimeo.com/11113885

  • kanadra @ at 2:28 am, August 9th, 2010

    Very interesting, the way different people associate those words… there are so many similarities and differences between race and gender for each different word, some of which one might not expect.

  • K8 AH @ at 9:42 am, August 9th, 2010

    Perhaps “patriarchy” should have been one of the words she asked people about… :/

  • Nona @ at 2:30 pm, August 13th, 2010

    Thanks for the shoutout Julie! I couldnt believe some guy actually said “opposite of woman” for “feminist.” Ouch!

  • blakerivers @ at 9:32 am, August 15th, 2010

    Ryan-
    I think you have to step back for a minute and remember that not all feminists, not even most, are the type of extremists that bother you. Believe it or not, most women want what is best for both men and women. In general, women love men. Read a romance book, watch a movie, spend time around happy couples. Women don’t want men to be disenfranchised; women want men to be happy and equal, and they hope the sentiment is mutual.

    Remember not to hold people’s ignorance against them. Some women simply don’t realize that some radical feminine philosophy actually hurts men. If they did realize this, then they would oppose it. And do not make the mistake of undermining just how serious the problem of sexism is for women. Women do have legitimate reasons for being angry and trying to educate themselves in “herstory” as opposed to male dominated history.

    The reason why feminism is more popular than masculinism (or masculism) is because there is much greater need for feminism. In fact, the automatic spell-checker flags “masculinism” because it doesn’t even recognize it as a word, where feminism is universally accepted. This is not inappropriate because women simply have less privilege than men and we all need to change that.

    I understand that it can be frustrating for men, trust me, but you need to brush it off and understand where women are coming from. Otherwise you will be blind to reality, and no one wants that.

  • Ryan @ at 10:31 pm, August 21st, 2010

    Blakerivers, you have no right to proclaim that women’s experience, thoughts, feelings etc are more important than that of men and boys.

    Men and boys have very serious issues many of which are in regard to changes and double standards that your feminism has created. Men have NO obligation or responsibility to provide to nor protect women.

    You are our competition with women first Affirmative Action and the diversion of the Stimulus Package to yourselves though 80% of jobs have been lost to men. You have no right to be put first. You acqire 60% of college degrees and have no right to put yourselves first.

  • blakerivers @ at 3:50 am, August 27th, 2010

    -Ryan – Calm down, friend. Maybe you should not get too emotional about this. You seem to misunderstand this whole issue.

    This isn’t about women versus men. This is not a battleground. I’m not going to fight with you over such petty terms; it’s childish.

    It is not the case that women’s experiences, thoughts, feelings etc. are more important than men’s; obviously not. That is not what I (or even many feminists) are proclaiming. At no point did I write that.

    Instead, there has been a structural power imbalance that has caused unfair oppression of women over the centuries. The exact same thing has been true for black people and white people. It’s not that black people’s feelings were more important than white people’s; it is that ending oppression of blacks was objectively more important than ending oppression of whites. Surely you would not seriously argue with that. It just about who drew the short straw.

    You have a right to be angry with women’s attitudes; many women do seek to put themselves first (as you put it) and indeed they do expect special treatment and more consideration. This is wrong, of course. But you cannot blame them too much–they are emerging from a culture of institutionalized oppression. You might do the same thing if you were in their shoes.

    Do not confuse the faults of individuals with the faults of feminism.

    Lastly, you say that men have no obligation to provide for women. Yes, this is true to a degree. But as human beings, we all have a certain responsibility to provide for each other. If you are the father in a family, you have a responsibility to provide for that family. The same is true for the mother. Everyone, regardless of race or gender, has responsibilities.

    Ask yourself, do you want true equality? If so, you should see the need for feminism. Feminism is not in opposition to masculism–why can’t you see that?

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